Print Story Sharecropping Around The Drain
Ranting
By rizzo (Sat Jan 05, 2008 at 04:53:28 PM EST) (all tags)
This was a mega-rant I posted as a reply to a Hole entry by Blixco (which shall not be linked), which he continued in these recent ruminations on the subject of the Big Crisis.

I kinda dashed through multiple topics from working in IT to banking and capitalism to web marketing to sustainable living to escaping the Empire, and features the original quote:

"Capitalism is a pernicious fractal algorithm that, left to iterate for more than a few generations, will completely destroy society." --Me

Read on to get pissed off at something. Probably me...


Holyfuckingshitwheredoibegin...

Working IT is starting to become like working for Wall St., unless you literally work in IT on Wall St., then you're double-fucked.

Information is now money. Money is now information. The Rothschilds and their lapdog Rockefellers, Morgans, Chases, Harrimans, Cheneys, DuPonts, Bushes, other assorted Bonesmen, et. al. may not have seen the Information Age coming, or seen the constructively anarchistic inevitabilities of an ungoverned, directly-democratized global instantaneous communication infrastructure and its ability to level both the economic playing field and the human marketplace of ideas, but they sure as hell envisioned and have now nearly perfected a system of centralized, worthless electronic fiat money that literally makes everyone but them poorer and destroys every country that doesn't relent to their murderous system of economic hegemony. Capitalism is a pernicious fractal algorithm that, left to iterate for more than a few generations, will completely destroy society. You can fucking quote me on that, bitches.

So that leaves us working in an industry where we are the wizards who shape information into value to humans who are willing to pay for it, and pay us for crafting value out of it for them. I see you're doing about as well as I am salary-wise. Essentially, we're sharecroppers here.

Fuck this. I know a lot of people in this industry that have ceased having fun in it. It used to feel like sitting around all day playing Atari, but that faux wood paneling and satisfying slide-switches have been replaced by bullshit projects, dickhead managers, infinitely-complex equipment, standards, protocols, practices evolving logarithmically into more complexity. The whole goddamned thing has been spiraling out of control since the transistor.

We were young enough to catch the wave while it was still fun to ride. But now it's been pyramidized by the system, just like privatizated healthcare, Amway, religion, the back of the goddamned one dollar bill... it's a scam and they fully know it. Henry Ford was famously quoted for saying there'd be a revolution overnight if the people woke up one day having realized the nature of the banking system.

I work in Search. Keywords = money. If you do paid search advertising, you can track this exact figure down to a millionth of a penny which, incidentally, is now worth more melted down than it is with Lincoln's slavery-supporting flip-flopping artificially-sweetened Log Cabin Lite head stamped on it (anything to save the Union). But anyway, big corps that shouldn't have the rights of real persons but should pay the taxes they actually owe are spending billions of dollars a year for clicks they can convert into profits. Web traffic is the new commodities market. I bet you'll see web traffic futures trading someday soon. We hold the keys to this massive, abundant, nearly-uncontrollable borderless economy, but you wouldn't know it from our fucking bank accounts would you.

Things I learn in the course of my job about building residual online income (without fucking anybody over in the process) could be applied full-time for myself if I had the time to spend on it, and I could easily make 3x what I'm currently making if I wasn't so busy paying bills with the day job. Catch-22 up my ass with a rusty wire brush.

I think everybody here who suggests you get out of IT is right. Do you ever read Cryptogon? This guy actually left a high-powered Wall St. job when he and his wife both woke up and realized the entire game was unsustainable and bound inexorably for a massive collapse, so they packed up and split for New Zealand where they bought a little farm for themselves to wait out the storm in peace, comfort and maximally-sustainable living. They sleep well at night, though it probably helps that his analysis nets him at least $1k a month in donations and gold-vaulting affiliate commissions on the frequent large buys by some apparently fairly well-off readers.

I'm not suggesting you become a farmer, though you do support sustainable farming as a very conscientious omnivore (despite the asinine runaway expense of eating real food), and I suspect (probably just can't admit that I know it like I know 1+1=2) that the only way to be truly free is to produce your own food. Ask your farmers. I guess knowing them all personally is the next best thing and for that, I commend you, suh. I'm just suggesting you find something you love enough to do in exchange for money that maximizes your liberty, like your farmers. We both know it ain't gonna happen on sysadminimum salary.

Since you apparently enjoy farting around on the web, it wouldn't hurt to try your hand during hours 25-28 of each day to build up some web properties of one kind or another. 6-12 month profitability with no startup costs and the promise of sustained residuals, or 1-2 week profitability with any capital investment whatsoever, all unlimited growth potential due to the "long tail" of natural abundance, the very opposite of the paradigmatic economy of fake scarcity currently enslaving us as chattel. In short, it's the foolish worker bee's last best chance of getting above the line being drawn through the middle of the middle class as the two lines above and below fade into history thanks to our friends, the bankers. I know a guy I hang out with in Vegas every year who makes $20k/mo in the most ridiculously simple manner with carefully-crafted Google AdWords campaigns and some carefully-researched affiliate programs, and he says he doesn't even maintain it but if he did, it'd easily double the money. Very nice guy too. Kobe filets were on him. I know somebody else who just got started making some affiliate sites and promotional blogs in the last year and is now pulling $1-2k/mo and rising, with a day job and a baby. PM me if you want a big steaming braindump.

Why the fuck do I get involved in other people's programming projects instead of my own web marketing? Programming is so thankless, economically linear and always temporary. I must be stupid.

Anyway...

The other concern here is taxes. You don't want to support a narco-criminal black-ops terrorist fascist neo-liberal technocratic globalist orwellian regime who spends most of your tax money on murderous activities around the world by literal armies of brainwashed browncoats and even more dangerous band of privatized hombres armados they now command, instead of spending it to support whacko social services like, idunno, education or solar/wind research instead of stealing our food supply to make gas and deliberately, systematically destroying free public education to ensure continuation of the great wall of socioeconomic divide between us and Them.

I've been wanting to leave the country more and more since I realized and continue to grok the scale and depth of the trouble with our empire. Speaking of the word, have you ever read Final Empire, particularly Chapter 13? I think you'd get a tremendous pile of mindmeat out of it.

We currently have an unprecedented combination of several perfectly-precedented factors in this country:

First, we have a scam economy perpetrated by a small group of international bankers and other wealthy upper-1%-ers bent on incrementally destroying national sovereignty around the world in order to create a technocratic totalitarian global economic-military-industrial panopticon police state dictatorship under their private, capitalist control. They've nearly perfected this system in England without anyone noticing, so you don't want to move there. Canada is close behind, but the good old USA is leading the pack as with anything unsustainable and hegemonic.

Second, the federal government has been seized by cabal of ridiculous ideologues who have performed an ingenious slow coup over the course of several supposed elections through the use of systematic vote fraud and voter manipulation. Upon seizing power, they have systematically destroyed every useful federal government function in favor of purely unsustainable capitalism through privatization.

Then they perpetrate the largest false-flag attack ever performed on a country's own citizens, and do so just sloppily enough to leave a distinct trail of evidence and revision for anyone to follow.

Then, through the CIA's drug importation operations in Jeb's home state which trained the pilots, Marvin's ownership of the security firm in charge of the WTC complex which stood down bomb-sniffing dogs the week before (long enough for engineers to power-down security and wire up the buildings the weekend before), the law changes which handed Cheney operational control of our air defenses, and the zionist scumbag lab worker that stole bioweapon spores from the Army which ended up in only the offices of those few lawmakers opposed to blanket-acceptance of the doublespeak-named megalaw that instantly, quietly destroyed our "goddamned piece of paper" upon which the Republic ("if you can keep it") was founded. Then they repealed the fucking Magna Carta. The fucking MAGNA CARTA!

Where does it end? Ask Orwell, ask Huxley, ask Thompson. Ask Kay Griggs if you can handle it. The open source software "gotcha" of having nobody to complain to but yourself has prepared we geeks and tech-wizards of the world to become more than complainers like the insipid hell desk callers some of us deal with regularly (much like Congressional aides), and actually want to fix the world to resemble that which we've modeled online.

But this raises an interesting point which was made to me one night last November at an In-N-Out Burger in Las Vegas (the one in the off-ramp nook over by the Orleans at the south end of the Strip). I was sitting there explaining the big picture, particularly the proven facts of 9/11, to the Fox-news-watching Republican owner of a popular single-word dot-com domain who is seated across from me, drunk from an afternoon of open bar revelry, wearing the In-N-Out Burger paper hat, saying "if you really think that's what the government is doing then you should just leave the country and never come back." then proceeds to, in all seriousness with checkbook suddenly in-hand, to offer me a five-digit sum of money "RIGHT NOW" if I will actually leave the country and never return.

My initial reaction was that it wasn't nearly enough money, and he wasn't willing to pay anything close to a hundred grand, so after one last chance offer, the checkbook went away and he devoured a handful of wild-style fries.

That's when the hippie from Humbolt County pipes up, slowly, to say: "Dude, like, you could just leave, but like, you could stay and fight."

The kid may have a point, then again, his point may ring as hollow as the points lodged in Bhutto's head, or Kennedy's for that matter. Is being a boy scout patriot really worth fighting for? Has it ever been?

The globalists may be right about one thing -- national borders are unnecessary. As unnecessary as their global government, global currency and global ID card. We just need to redraw the lines in the only way that should make sense to an Earth-bound global society of primates -- bio-regionally. So I guess you can either stick around and try to fight the Man without getting killed in order to start to build a more sensible working order where you live now, or since you're a sovereign citizen of planet Earth, go pick another place you actually want to live in that surrounds you with a community of helpful people who can work towards the same goals of building a sustainable habitat and environment where people have the luxury of self-expression, creativity, liberty and thus true transcendent happiness instead of this evil, penetrating negativist bullshit toxic corporate consumerist culture

So the question that's been on my mind is... how far away is far enough?

You have to escape the Empire before it fully consumes your immediate vicinity and prevents you from leaving freely, and just like the one before it, the sun never sets upon this Empire, and it's like a robot programmed to destroy all countries and governments by algorithmic iteration of its own natural tendencies. Your options are limited, and bound by what you're interested in doing with your life, and probably to a lesser extent which languages you speak, though you're already fluent in Earth's de-facto official language (sorry Shat, my man).

I'd love it if Cancun or Toronto were far enough away, but they aren't. Venezuela has become an exemplary social democracy, and would be a lovely place to live as long as the entrenched mega-terrorists don't end up invading it or foment a violent coup through their established operatives in the media and government down there. I know a hydrodynamic purification expert who moved to El Salvador because they're "way freeer", although I'm not sure why. Ecuador just kicked the bastards out, but they're letting even bigger bastards in, so probably not there. Generally, I thinkt he Bolivaran socialist experiment in Venezuela and surrounding mexicanese appetizer-sized countries is a valuable one, and I'm in favor of just about anything the gummint doesn't want us to have. Like guns, LSD or even weed, there's probably a very good reason or twelve for it. Free thinkers undermine fascism.

Anyone have any better ideas of where to go? There's lots of great resources and first-hand wisdom at EscapeArtist.com, like this little gem: "The Internal Revenue Service recently decided to be clever. Their theory was to check an expatriates' tax status when the expat went into a U.S. embassy to renew his or her U.S. passport. However, unbeknownst to the IRS, expats are no longer renewing their U.S. passports. What expatriates are now doing is getting second passports from another nation before their U.S. passport expires"

So perhaps that's the trick. Get out while you can, and get a passport from somewhere else ASAP. Make sure you don't need to ever come back, because they might not let you in.
< The Sundering (Dread Empire's Fall) | The Rape of Nanking: The Forgotten Holocaust of World War II >
Sharecropping Around The Drain | 157 comments (157 topical, 0 hidden) | Trackback
Things in the queue by blixco (4.00 / 4) #1 Wed Jan 02, 2008 at 10:17:29 PM EST
are strange here, but I'd love to see the discussion in this as a front page post.
---------------------------------
"You bring the weasel, I'll bring the whiskey." - kellnerin


As an added bonus by rizzo (2.00 / 0) #29 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 12:36:06 PM EST
When you get tired of life on the gray scale in the comments, you can watch HuSi polarize themselves in story moderation into two neat piles of which colored pill they've taken.

I know Rush said "if you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice" but I don't quite buy that when it comes to seeking knowledge yourself vs. allowing all of it to be spoon-fed to you your whole life by massive interests.  The former is a decision, the latter is simply someone else's decision made for you that you've never questioned because you didn't realize there was a distinction upon which to choose.

--

[ Parent ]

OK, let me get my list... by MohammedNiyalSayeed (3.68 / 16) #2 Wed Jan 02, 2008 at 10:28:15 PM EST
  1. 12 Jew Bankers reference: check
  2. What Really Happened Dot Com link: check
  3. Awesome supposition that if someone once worked for the Big Bad CIA, they couldn't possibly get tired of not getting paid shit to do dangerous work and decide to team up with some ex law enforcement buddies of theirs and smuggle drugs into the country, as part of a nice, profitable idea, but instead constitutes proof that the Big Bad CIA controls every thing you do, even down to where you get your cocaine: check
  4. Use of term "zionist", lower-case, as pre-emptive defense against expected claims of anti-Semitism: check
  5. "Venezuela has become an exemplary social democracy": check
  6. Flee-the-countryism: check

It is for these reasons that I have no choice but to vote story to front page, as it is just the sort of paranoid, delusional, white-boy-angst that will encourage the discussion of its ideas with consideration, logic, and civility, and I feel the community, as a whole, stands only to benefit in this exchange of the minds.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.


You can pull the Israeli cock out of your mouth by theboz (4.00 / 3) #5 Wed Jan 02, 2008 at 11:31:24 PM EST
# 12 Jew Bankers reference: check

...


# Use of term "zionist", lower-case, as pre-emptive defense against expected claims of anti-Semitism: check

I didn't see where he said that the money people were Jewish, or even that there were 12 of them.  Also, his term of zionist may have been accurate if he was referencing someone like members of the JDL, which I'm not sure.  Altogether though, people seem to be way too sensitive on the internet about criticizing Israel or Jewish individuals.  It's like if a Jewish guy farts and someone complains, the cries of anti-semitism fly long before the echo of the air-biscuit dissipates.  I agree that neo-nazis suck, that Jews have had to put up with a disproportionate amount of shit throughout history, and that anti-semitism is a real problem.  I just don't think that someone using words like "banker" or "zionist" in sentences are crimes against humanity.  When did banker become synonymous with Jew anyway?  Isn't that a bit racist to assume bankers are Jewish?
- - - - -
That's what I always say about you, boz, you have a good memory for random facts about pussy. -- joh3n
[ Parent ]

My ability to read subtext by MohammedNiyalSayeed (4.00 / 2) #6 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 12:02:43 AM EST

is better than yours. It's probably because I recognize it as subtext. When I see coded, dumbed-down and sanitized versions of what is obviously going through someone's mind, I don't feel the need to sit around with my thumb up my ass before I predict where they're going to go with it, because it's predictable.

The accusation that I "assume bankers are Jewish" is shitbrained. If you start telling me a story I've already heard a thousand times over, don't expect me to wait until you get around to telling the punchline before I tell you I've already heard that joke.

Not to mention the whole "race != religion" thing. Then again, I recall you not having much of a grasp on the technical definition of "fascism" not too long ago, too.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

Isn't that a form of prejudice? by theboz (2.00 / 0) #14 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 09:43:10 AM EST
When I see coded, dumbed-down and sanitized versions of what is obviously going through someone's mind, I don't feel the need to sit around with my thumb up my ass before I predict where they're going to go with it, because it's predictable.

That's sort of like seeing a black guy walking down the street and automatically getting scared because you have seen that there are many black burglars.  It's better to give people the benefit of the doubt, in my opinion.
If you start telling me a story I've already heard a thousand times over, don't expect me to wait until you get around to telling the punchline before I tell you I've already heard that joke.

You've read this diary prior to it being posted on HuSi?
Not to mention the whole "race != religion" thing.

For Jewish people, the two are more intertwined than normal.  Neo-nazis are racists, and hate jews.  They don't care if it's someone that is atheist or is a non-participating Jew.  Hitler certainly didn't ask people how strongly they believe in their religion before putting them on the death trains.
I recall you not having much of a grasp on the technical definition of "fascism" not too long ago, too.

For what, saying that Bush has fascist tendencies?  It's pretty clear cut.  If you look at the dictionary it says:
a governmental system led by a dictator having complete power, forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism, regimenting all industry, commerce, etc., and emphasizing an aggressive nationalism and often racism.

We certainly have a government trending towards giving dictatorial powers to the president, who has basically declared himself above Congress rather than a co-equal branch of the government.  Criticism and opposition are suppressed, both via the corporate media and by implementing fascist policies like spying on American citizens without even FISA warrants and by establishing bullshit like "free speech zones" instead of treating the whole nation as a free speech zone as the Constitution dictates.  Monopolization of various industries has skyrocketed under the Bush-controlled government.  The nationalism (or rather, jingoism) and racism are pretty apparent.  Any criticism of Bush becomes "proof" that you hate the U.S. and must support "turrurists", and the racism has exploded against arabs in general, but also against latinos, chinese, and blacks (aka Katrina victims.)  So fascist tendencies are the nicest way to describe Bush and his administration.
- - - - -
That's what I always say about you, boz, you have a good memory for random facts about pussy. -- joh3n
[ Parent ]

The first part of the definition is the real part by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #27 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 12:31:26 PM EST

You can't just ignore the fact that the President is not a dictator, now matter how many hippies' signs say he is, and that elections still occur at regular intervals, in order to slip by that first definition requirement. Since Bush has been President, nothing has fundamentally changed. You don't see it, because you're absorbed by your own emotions, but 100 years will prove me correct. Everything else you site is alarmism, and as such, I'm dismissing it all.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

I'll take that bet by theboz (2.00 / 0) #30 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 12:41:25 PM EST
You can't just ignore the fact that the President is not a dictator, now matter how many hippies' signs say he is, and that elections still occur at regular intervals, in order to slip by that first definition requirement.

Which is why I said he has fascist tendencies, rather than being a full-on fascist dictator.  He is leading us towards a dictatorship, but he is not at that point, and it will probably be another president or two before we get to that point.
Since Bush has been President, nothing has fundamentally changed.

Not true.  He has used signing statements in a novel way, which lets him pass "laws" unrelated to the original bills or dramatically altering the bills with no accountability.  That is a step towards a dictator.  He also has declared the office of the Vice President to be a separate, fourth branch of the government that is not accountable to Congress.  These and more are huge fundamental changes.

You don't see it, because you're absorbed by your own emotions, but 100 years will prove me correct.

Ok, I'll take this challenge.  Find a way to make both of us live at least 100 more years and we'll see who is right.
Everything else you site is alarmism, and as such, I'm dismissing it all.

AKA you don't want to think that things can be wrong because it is too difficult to comprehend and look at objectively, so you ignore them.  There is no reason why your personal philosophy of "It always ends in tears" should not apply to nations and societies.  In fact, I would say that in larger groups of people, it gets exponentially worse.
- - - - -
That's what I always say about you, boz, you have a good memory for random facts about pussy. -- joh3n
[ Parent ]

Yes, your alarmism makes me uncomfortable by MohammedNiyalSayeed (4.00 / 2) #34 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 01:18:44 PM EST

because I don't understand it. Look, you haven't been detained for speaking up, you won't be detained for speaking up, and in one year, there'll be a brand new president. Two years after that, there'll be a whole new crop of Senators and Congressmen. Two years after that, whatever party of the two parties offered will be whining about how corrupt and evil the other party is, and then they'll switch places and the cycle will begin anew. All of our lives remain relatively unchanged, and that is intentional; one does not maintain a hold on power by pushing the populace too far.

The fact of the matter is you've never really had "freedom"; you've had a controlled series of options determined by the economic situations and abilities of those who maintain that power. You may finally be aware of it now, but that doesn't make it new, and it still won't be new when it's your "party" doing it to the "other party". Cry if you want, I'm not naive enough to be shocked by any of this, and you're old enough to know better, too.

I suppose coming to the conclusion you have no power takes some time to get used to, though, eh?


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

fascism and democracy aren't exclusive by lm (2.00 / 0) #39 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 02:05:55 PM EST
There is no prima facie reason why a fascist state can't be organized around an elected president. The fact that the US will have a new president soon says nothing about whether or not the US is moving towards fascism.

OTOH, abundant freedoms such as the right to privacy, habeas corpus, freedom of the press, etc., indicate that the US doesn't seem to be generally moving in the direction of fascism. Generally speaking, I think it fair to say that US citizens enjoy more rights and freedoms now than they did during WWII. The same is true of WWII era US citizens, they enjoyed more rights and freedoms than most US citizens during Reconstruction. Rinse. Latter. Repeat.

But to be fair, that these freedoms exist doesn't mean that there aren't those who are trying to move the US to a different place vis a vis personal freedoms.


There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]

That isn't true. by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 2) #41 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 02:14:33 PM EST
Fascism: an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.

If the people have a say in their government, then it is not "authoritarian" enough a system to be called "fascist". Further, and I feel this is even more important, the vast majority of people who decry our government as "fascist" or "moving towards fascism" are 1) unaware of the definition of fascism, and 2) have yet to do the necessary logical footwork to persuade me that the introduction of fascism wouldn't be an improvement to what we have now.

All this whining about the loss of "personal freedoms" is typical of those who are insulated from real problems; because they have no real problems, these hypothetical problems and minor air travel inconveniences become The Biggest Problem, and Evidence of the Slippery Slope of the Erosion of Freedom. No matter how many morons claim it, it never becomes reality.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

Not completely accurate. by vorheesleatherface (2.00 / 0) #43 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 02:29:45 PM EST
If the people have a say in their government it just signifies that the cycle of fascism is not yet complete. That is how it works. Fascism is all about bullshitting people into believing that they are doing the right thing by giving up their liberties. Or, people only think they have say in their government, but they don't. "Authoritarian" can be a horse by another name. "Of course you're freemen. Now pay your taxes or your representatives will suspend your liberties." I think you'll find the equivalent of that last line was added to many State Constitutions after the U.S Constitution was made official.

"Stabbing someone in the head with a pitchfork is rarely beneficial to the relationship." - MereKat
[ Parent ]

Are we on the same planet? by lm (2.00 / 0) #63 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 04:21:42 PM EST
Of the three regimes widely considered to be the epitome of fascism (Franco's Spain, Mussolini's Italy and Hitler's Germany), only one (Spain) was not a popularly elected government.

I doubt you read the rest of my comment. Please go back and do so. You seem to have taken my point about rights and freedoms to mean the exact opposite of what I wrote. Freedom in the US is probably at or close to an all time high. This indicates that the US is no where close to being a fascist state.


There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]

Consider these regimes: by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #66 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 04:45:47 PM EST

Pol Pot, Nikolai Ceausescu, Li Si, António Salazar, Idi Amin, Jean-Claude Duvalier, and Enver Hoxha. Of them, Salazar was almost "elected" (if you count appointment by your friends who held a coup as "election"), and all of them were actually fascist, totalitarian state leaders.

That I addressed concerns that were not yours does not indicate that I am unaware of what you were saying. It indicates that what I am arguing against (eg: the claim that America is "moving towards fascism") is incorrect, and that I am not straying from that point.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

Let's take the non-fascists off that list by lm (4.00 / 1) #77 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 06:07:23 PM EST
Pol Pot, Nikolai Ceausescu, Li Si, António Salazar, Idi Amin, Jean-Claude Duvalier, and Enver Hoxha

It takes an authoritarian regime to be fascist, but not every authoritarian regime is fascist. Most of the dictators you mentioned don't have the corporatism that is one of the central tenets of fascism. Others lack the collectivism. Others like the populism. Some are simply petty thugs with no real ideology.


There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]

OK. by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #90 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 10:24:19 PM EST

-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

Go read about Duvalier's backers and by Horatio Hellpop (4.00 / 1) #102 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 01:34:42 AM EST
put him back on that list.
When there's only 7 millionaire families in your country, it's pretty easy to make rich friends.

"You can't really know something until you ruin it for everyone." -some guy who used to have an account here
[ Parent ]

IAWTP by blixco (4.00 / 1) #108 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 10:00:46 AM EST
in that this man has hardcore firsthand knowledge of what he speaks.
---------------------------------
"You bring the weasel, I'll bring the whiskey." - kellnerin
[ Parent ]

There's a better case for Papa Doc than Baby Doc by lm (4.00 / 1) #109 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 10:03:07 AM EST
Jean Claude was more a kleptocrat than a fascist, and barely that. Most of all he was a playboy clown that wanted little to do with government other than spending the money it made.

Granted, a state can be fascist and a kleptocracy. But it seems fairly clear to me that by the time the Duvalier's voluntarily went into exile that virtually all the fascist elements of the government had decayed into chaos. If MNS has listed Francois Duvalier, I'd probably not have crossed him off the list.


There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]

Allow me by vorheesleatherface (1.00 / 1) #83 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 06:56:05 PM EST
to step in and engage in some logical tap dancing. Fascism is an authoritarian system with emphasis on the importance of the state and unimportance of the individual and individual liberties. It is not however a classless system. Classlessness and common ownership belief would make it communism. Interesting how easy it is to go from one to another isn't it. Odd that they have historically opposed each other. I digress. With a class system in place, and the highest class, the authority, able to make any choices they want over the lower classes that have surrendered their individual rights, the majority of people in the state are susceptible to abuse from the higher class who have immunity from committing crimes on the lower class, and what's worse, the low class agreed to it. It is just plain peculiar and against animal nature to disregard our individual wellbeing and place our lives and the lives of our loved ones in the hands of people who we know think they are significantly suuperior to us. It is an indirect violation of survival instinct. It is a betrayal to our fellow human beings. That isn't better than what we have now because now at least we haven't had all of our guns taken away from us, our tax burdens feed social systems that provide for the underpriviledged the government creates, and higher classes can't get away with property theft or murder by simply doing to the lower class and saying that it was best for the state. We're better than that, and us "paranoid conspiracy theorists" would like to keep it from degrading worse than it is, because it can get a hell of a lot worse, but not if we get angry and fight.

"Stabbing someone in the head with a pitchfork is rarely beneficial to the relationship." - MereKat
[ Parent ]

Now that's a hay-man. by theboz (2.00 / 0) #65 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 04:30:41 PM EST
Look, you haven't been detained for speaking up, you won't be detained for speaking up

This is true, but has absolutely nothing to do with what I was talking about.  Just because a bad thing hasn't happened to me doesn't mean it hasn't happened to anyone.  Additionally, if you look to German history as a model, it isn't always just an overnight thing where someone declares themselves a dictator, if they ever do.  In Germany, Hitler was elected.  That didn't stop him from being evil or doing things that the German public may not have wanted.
...in one year, there'll be a brand new president. Two years after that, there'll be a whole new crop of Senators and Congressmen. Two years after that, whatever party of the two parties offered will be whining about how corrupt and evil the other party is, and then they'll switch places and the cycle will begin anew. All of our lives remain relatively unchanged, and that is intentional; one does not maintain a hold on power by pushing the populace too far.

The specific people filling the seats don't really matter when they all share the same agenda.  Bush doesn't need to declare himself dictator, because every single Republican candidate mirrors him, and most of the Democratic candidates either mirror him or are too spineless to actually fix things.

However, I disagree about things staying the same.  If you look at the events that eventually lead up to Krystalnacht, it was a slow, methodical change that occurred over time.  Basically the events of the end of WWI led directly to it, but at a pace not too many people really saw coming or cared to do anything about.  In fact, you can even say that the racism against the Jews and the jingoism of the Germans went back much longer.  The power that be are tweaking our government to get to the point they want it -- our rights and freedoms are being eroded, not suddenly yanked away.

The fact of the matter is you've never really had "freedom"; you've had a controlled series of options determined by the economic situations and abilities of those who maintain that power. You may finally be aware of it now, but that doesn't make it new, and it still won't be new when it's your "party" doing it to the "other party". Cry if you want, I'm not naive enough to be shocked by any of this, and you're old enough to know better, too.

Of course I'm aware of the conditions of life, and I accept that I can't do everything I want.  Again, you've built a hay-man, because nowhere did I indicate that I lack any understanding of this.  The only difference between that understanding and what I hope for is that things can be changed somewhat for the better, rather than things getting worse.

Also, I have no "party" that represents me.  It would be cool if I did, but nobody would elect them.
- - - - -
That's what I always say about you, boz, you have a good memory for random facts about pussy. -- joh3n
[ Parent ]

The problem I have with what you think by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 1) #67 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 04:50:14 PM EST

is that you seem to earnestly believe that the "powers that be" is an entity with actually-defined, secretive goals. This is patently absurd, and a six-month stint in any federal agency would show this to be the opposite of "physically possible".

Another prime difference is that only one of us believes in "hope". For some unknown reason, you seem to think people have some inherent right to this "freedom" nonsense, and I, on the other hand, think that everyone should be killed. That'd liberate them, for sure. They'd be liberated from sucking up resources, liberated from paying their bills, and best of all, I'd be liberated from listening to their self-indulgent nonsense.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

That's not it by theboz (3.00 / 1) #68 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 05:18:54 PM EST
you seem to earnestly believe that the "powers that be" is an entity with actually-defined, secretive goals.

No, I don't think so at all.  They operate openly.  The goal is to establish profit for themselves and their families, and keep the bloodline going.  There's nothing more than that.
Another prime difference is that only one of us believes in "hope". For some unknown reason, you seem to think people have some inherent right to this "freedom" nonsense, and I, on the other hand, think that everyone should be killed. That'd liberate them, for sure. They'd be liberated from sucking up resources, liberated from paying their bills, and best of all, I'd be liberated from listening to their self-indulgent nonsense.

I also believe in equality, and that what is good for me is good for others, and vice versa.  If I believed that everyone else deserved to die (which I don't) I would be doing what I can to further those goals, as well as implementing it for myself.  Of course, I also don't believe that you believe what you wrote.  You like to think you do because it helps you get through the day, but I think it's more of an image thing.
- - - - -
That's what I always say about you, boz, you have a good memory for random facts about pussy. -- joh3n
[ Parent ]

Then why by blixco (2.00 / 0) #95 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 11:25:44 PM EST
are you here?

Not here as in HuSi, but here as in the planet?
---------------------------------
"You bring the weasel, I'll bring the whiskey." - kellnerin
[ Parent ]

Because I am entirely too unmotivated by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #100 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 01:20:28 AM EST

to load this P226 and end this endless stream of shit, but mainly because it'd break my Mom's heart, so I stay. For now.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

That's as good a reason by blixco (2.00 / 0) #107 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 08:35:28 AM EST
as any.

(Plus, I'd hate to see you go, but purely for selfish reasons)
---------------------------------
"You bring the weasel, I'll bring the whiskey." - kellnerin
[ Parent ]

It's the only reason I've got by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #110 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 10:16:15 AM EST

But it can't last forever.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

True, by blixco (2.00 / 0) #112 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 10:26:54 AM EST
but evolution happens, sometimes, in our thinking....
---------------------------------
"You bring the weasel, I'll bring the whiskey." - kellnerin
[ Parent ]

You never know. by MohammedNiyalSayeed (4.00 / 1) #113 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 10:31:09 AM EST

At this rate, change seems to be sweeping to the opposite position, though. But yeah, time changes shit some times.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

Actually there have been fundamental changes by vorheesleatherface (2.00 / 0) #36 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 01:54:47 PM EST
under Bush. Such as NSPD-51/ HSPD-20, and also Public Law 109-364, or the "John Warner Defense Authorization Act of 2007" (H.R.5122). Bush has declared that the President can in fact declare a dictatorhship and take complete control anytime the President wants.

"Stabbing someone in the head with a pitchfork is rarely beneficial to the relationship." - MereKat
[ Parent ]

Really? by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #38 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 02:03:28 PM EST

That's not my definition of "fundamental". Congress passes laws every goddamn year, so, yes, little tiny things change. Let me know when Der Bush Führer has assumed power for a third term, I'll take one of your tin foil hats then, thanks.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

What about the dictionary definition by vorheesleatherface (2.00 / 0) #42 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 02:20:07 PM EST
 of fundamental? I think that since a Democracy, as imperfect as it may be, is clearly against dictatorship, that my abovementioned changes would qualify as fundemental. Also, I think you may have your conspiracies mixed up. Tin foil hats are so the alien beings from another galaxy that live in my underwear drawer can't force me to give them my spare change.

If the president ever takes a third term, then that wouldn't be a big deal in and of itself. It is the power that the President has that is a big deal. The 22nd Amendment to the Constitution was ratified on February 26, 1951. Before then, it was only a tradition to be in office for only two terms, but not a legal limitation. We've had Presidents for more than two terms, but none of them had the option of total power.

"Stabbing someone in the head with a pitchfork is rarely beneficial to the relationship." - MereKat
[ Parent ]

I have nothing mixed-up by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #45 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 02:37:00 PM EST

I conflate the two paranoid conspiracy theories to show that they are both identical in their silliness.

It's very simple, really; those with power do what they want, those without spend their time talking about what people with power do. This is how things have been, fundamentally, for thousands of years. Nothing has changed but the occupants of power. There is no grand plot to whittle away the liberties of you or anyone else, there are just countless bureaucrats plugging away at whatever tasks they've lined up for themselves, and people with capital at the top, renting offices for 2 to 4 year terms.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

I see your point. by vorheesleatherface (2.00 / 0) #51 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 03:16:37 PM EST
Power is in the same hands it has been in for a long time. What can, and is changing I think, is how many people are getting pissed about it and are brave enough, or crazy enough to do something about it. It always happens eventually, there is war, bankruptcy, or both. Then the chance to start over, good or bad. When I think about it, there was an opportunity for a not-so-bad form of government when the articles of confederacy were being used. But then the federalists broke the law (another discussion all together) and got rid of it in favor of a new constitution that was very different and established many more limitations on civil liberties, and states powers. That was the end of it right there. For those years that the confederation was in effect, it looks to have been pretty good. A step in a good direction. So what I'm saying here is that you may be correct. Maybe nothing has been "fundamentally" different since 1787, depending on your interpretation of "fundamental." With perhaps the exception of the civil war that resulted in increasing numbers of citizens calling themselves Americans instead of Virginians or New Yorkers or whatever. It helped solidify the acceptance of the new central government. What do you think? Is a paradigm shift a "fundamental" change?

"Stabbing someone in the head with a pitchfork is rarely beneficial to the relationship." - MereKat
[ Parent ]

It's a shift in details, really. by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 1) #56 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 03:28:54 PM EST

From the framework of what things were like in 1787, things may be slightly different now, but taken from the perspective of, say, a couple thousand years, people behave in largely the same manner, and those with the means and motivation use the alleged power of the collectivity of State to assert their power over the general population, same as always. That things have always been this way isn't evidence that everyone in power in history has worked in concert with everyone else in power (which I don't mean to say that you're saying they have), but rather evidence of human nature. Our behavior, as individuals, and as a species, is hugely predictable because it is always determined by the same factors.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

If that is true, by vorheesleatherface (2.00 / 0) #64 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 04:22:43 PM EST
, and we are as predictable as we think we are, which history tends to agree with, then eventually there will be a revolt or a really, really bad economic depression. No telling when. And I ponder, do I want to live in the predictable State that treats me like a complete slave, or a predictable state that treats me like a semi-slave. Maybe even a predictable new State because the old one just got its ass handed to it. What part of the predictable life cycle of government do I want to live in? I think the U.S. is past its midway point. Enough people don't like it, including myself, but not quite enough to start killing our government yet. However we're getting closer to that every day. I think a young state may be a nice place to live, but you've got to manage to live through the war to get there. I don't want to go to another country because I don't see anyone any better off than we are. It appears to suck everywhere. Maybe someone else will blow up their country and start over so I can move there.

"Stabbing someone in the head with a pitchfork is rarely beneficial to the relationship." - MereKat
[ Parent ]

So what I was really getting at was by vorheesleatherface (2.00 / 0) #80 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 06:28:10 PM EST
just because people have a history of putting up with bullshit they don't like is no logical reason why they should continue to do so. "Fool me once shame on you..." If we're not even going to try to better ourselves and have a good time here on Earth we may as well just nuke the entire fucking planet and give up.

"Stabbing someone in the head with a pitchfork is rarely beneficial to the relationship." - MereKat
[ Parent ]

People's history of putting up with bullshit by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #89 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 10:23:18 PM EST

doesn't need to be a justification for anything. To me, it's a logical reason to assume that they will continue to put up with bullshit, just like they always have, and always will. I don't see any particular need to take on the impossible task of changing any of it when I can spend my time how to best make it work to my advantage, and bide my time until I die.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

...always have and always will? by vorheesleatherface (2.00 / 0) #97 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 12:50:03 AM EST
Tell it to someone who got maimed in a Civil War. Here is a list of them for you to choose from.

"Stabbing someone in the head with a pitchfork is rarely beneficial to the relationship." - MereKat
[ Parent ]

Your ability to read subtext by rizzo (4.00 / 2) #22 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 11:54:57 AM EST
needs work.

Not all Jews are international bankers, you freakin racist! As Conrad LeBeau, founder of the Christian Credit Society [for farmers] said, ''Not all Jews are international bankers, not all international bankers are Jews. There is no anti-Semitism in me. I feel no resentment to Italians because some are members of the Mafia.'"

Coincidentally, many of the more prominent ones happen to be Jews, but I don't hold that against the Jewish people (especially all the pissed-off rabbis, with whom I would be honored to stand beside in protest) because those bankers, in addition to being radical elitist economists, are also anti-brown-people, pro-fascism Zionists like Murdock, Perle, Zakheim, Wolfowitz, Chertoff and Hillary to name a few. That's the problem. Not the Jews.

Don't feel bad, though. Not even Hitler could get that one straight.
--

[ Parent ]

Invoking Hitler so soon? by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 1) #26 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 12:27:53 PM EST

That's just lazy, woman.

Here's an exercise for you: convince me fascism is a bad thing, when the world is populated by brain-damaged halfwits who think the CIA flew airplanes into the World Trade Center. If those are the douchebags allowed to determine their own fate, I'd prefer they all be mopped up.

I'll ignore your silly racism claims, since they're what is known in the psychological field as "projection".


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

the CIA? by rizzo (4.00 / 2) #31 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 12:50:29 PM EST
I never said nor do I think the CIA had a whole lot to do with 9/11. They created al Qaeda and they protect a lot of drug smuggling which are both tangentially related to 9/11, but the Mossad sounds directly involved in some details and the Pakistani ISI for others, chiefly wiring funds to Atta right before the big event.

A lot of laws were altered by the Administration which handed them the ability to stand down and confuse NORAD by creating numerous simultaneous identical hijacking exercises (just like the 7/7 London tube bombings) and through CJCSI 3610.01A the ability to directly stand-down aerial interceptions.

Maybe you would be interested in the Coincidence Theorist's Guide to 9/11?

As for the silly racist claims, you're right. I was being facetious because you're obviously not a racist and to me it was in a kind of funny context, but I'm definitely not projecting. I'm pro-human, any color or origin, but I'm totally anti-sociopath.
--

[ Parent ]

You know what I'm not interested in? by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #33 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 01:09:29 PM EST

The specific details of your paranoid theory. How you reorganize facts to support your delusions is your business, and unless you're offering me 500/hr to psychoanalyze you, payable up-front and in advance, rounded up to the first 8 hours, I don't feel any particular responsibility to help your wade through the muck that is your thinking process.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

you remind me of by rizzo (2.00 / 0) #60 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 04:04:41 PM EST
the black guy.
--

[ Parent ]

Use words to say what you mean by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #62 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 04:11:24 PM EST

I've not got the time to sit here and watch youtube videos all day. That's not why my Corporate Masters pay me so well.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

QED. [n/t] by rizzo (2.00 / 0) #72 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 05:39:13 PM EST

--

[ Parent ]

That's a big Latin acronym for a dude by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #74 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 06:03:30 PM EST

who seems to think popular culture is a valid place to get insight on dudes as awesome as me.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

art is the lie by rizzo (2.00 / 0) #76 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 06:06:06 PM EST
that reflects the truth, my man.
--

[ Parent ]

I smell bullshit. by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #82 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 06:35:53 PM EST

You need to take a shower.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

According to the story you linked to . . . by Billy Goat (4.00 / 1) #132 Sat Jan 05, 2008 at 04:24:37 PM EST
There was no significant time lapse due to the planned training which, according to the story you linked to, wasn't scheduled to occur until several hours after the 9/11 attacks. In that story, the first query of "Is this real-world or exercise?" occurs at 08:37:52 and by 08:37:56 the real-world status is confirmed. From the story:

WATSON: What?
DOOLEY: Whoa!
WATSON: What was that?
ROUNTREE: Is that real-world?
DOOLEY: Real-world hijack.
WATSON: Cool!

That's all of 4 seconds of confusion.

Do you read these links before you post them? Or do you just assume we won't read them?

As for the London drill - it was a private PR firm called Visor Consultants that handles "crisis management" in the media - that was holding a drill. No government folks, no first responders, nobody who would serve some nefarious plan by being confused.

Finally, the document you linked never mentions aerial interceptions of civilian craft. It enacts a "must resist" policy in hijack situations where military and military contract craft are involved. It goes on to state that, when the military or military contract craft is unmanned, destruction of the craft is an option. I'd like to think you simply linked to the wrong document, though I suspect this is another case of your not reading the document or your assuming we wouldn't.

[ Parent ]

dude by MillMan (4.00 / 4) #3 Wed Jan 02, 2008 at 11:08:57 PM EST
this is me after years of hallucinogen abuse.

When I'm imprisoned as an enemy combatant, will you blog about it?


MAY I SUGGEST by discordia (4.00 / 1) #7 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 02:10:01 AM EST
REGULAR MIXINGS OF BOOMERS AND OXY

[ Parent ]

I want to perform this by 606 (4.00 / 9) #4 Wed Jan 02, 2008 at 11:31:06 PM EST
as a monologue. A breathless angry rant full of scare quotes and sudden pointing at the audience.

-----
imagine dancing banana here


what a load of horse shit by theantix (4.00 / 4) #8 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 02:33:46 AM EST
This was much less factual and much less entertaining than what I recall on Adequacy.  I had several paragraphs here written to explain the specifics of your idiocy but I will leave it with my conclusion instead.

You suck.
____________________________________
mns: oh, dude, join my facebook group!


Oooh someone needs a nap! by Breaker (4.00 / 2) #9 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 04:43:52 AM EST
Why didn't you post the complete perfection of your rebuttal instead of the useless post your eager little mouthfingers spewed forth?


[ Parent ]

who said complete perfection by theantix (4.00 / 2) #79 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 06:09:34 PM EST
It's impossible to rebut the rambling nonsense of a babbling conspiracy theorist.  I tried for a bit and failed to be able to do it without also rambling about nonsense.  Conspiracy theories are a simple formula: you tie together half-truths and facts out of context and weave them into a narrative that goes in a wild direction.

Yeah, Bush is wrongheaded and incompetent, unrestrained capitalism leaves people behind, our resource usage levels are unsustainable.  It sucks that other people are richer and more powerful than you, that your job changes more frequently than you'd like, and that the government doesn't do everything you want it to.

But he gets so riled up over that that he goes and believes in every story every nutter on the internet has come up with, and then uses those stories as the basis for trying to tie in even more ridiculous conclusions.  If it's entertaining enough you can get Kevin Costner to make a movie with you,  if it's a little bit more far out you write on the interet about cubic time or how zionists (maybe the same ones who plague rizzo?) teamed up with the CIA and FBI and UN World Police and Secret Service and black helicopters and Dick Cheney to blow up the WTC towers.  This is not even that... this is less than that.  This is crazy person yelling on the street corner about that the end is nigh.  It's bullshit, it's useless, and it's stupid.  And I'm more stupid now too for having to explain all this to you, because everything I've said here is pretty fucking obvious.
____________________________________
mns: oh, dude, join my facebook group!
[ Parent ]

You forget by Breaker (4.00 / 3) #85 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 07:12:28 PM EST
This is a multinational site.

What may seem obvious to your own blinkered North Americas experience (doubtless trammelled by your own prejudices) is perhaps an invitation to others to discuss the relative merits of these thoughts in a global arena and perhaps bring a more reasoned approach to the matter, and who knows, some intelligent discussion despite the tone of the original post.

Simply saying "OMG FUCKTARD" brings nothing to the conversation really, does it?

Perhaps you believe yourself as stupid because you've done nothing to further the debate? 

It must hurt you every time you have to declaim "everyone's stupid because they don't think like ME". 

If it doesn't, I hope you do not have access to firearms.


[ Parent ]

They aren't stupid for not thinking like theantix by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #87 Thu Jan 03, 2008 at 10:20:51 PM EST

They are stupid for not thinking at all.

"Ideas" warrant discussion. "Paranoid delusions" warrant dismissal, mockery, and should be used as a tracking mechanism to keep abreast of the relative locations of morons. All of our safety is at risk here; I, for one, want to see who the morons are, and who they are not, so I fully encourage this thing being "discussed" here.

And yes, I have access to firearms. Two within three feet of here, even. Best of all, I'm a trained killer, rather than some amateur with "officers think was a shotgun", unable to kill an unarmed woman police officer. Man, you dudes have a lot to learn about proper gun violence.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

Not thinking at all by Breaker (2.00 / 0) #104 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 03:26:54 AM EST
Would mean sucking it all up, rather than looking for the black helicopters circling overhead.

I'm a trained killer

Really?  By whom?  Have you ever been in a situation where the safety's off and your knuckles are white on the trigger?


[ Parent ]

A minor distinction between the two by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #105 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 03:40:54 AM EST

Different empty, sugary beverage, same straw.

And yes, by an undisclosed entity, relatively recently, and yes, respectively.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

Or by Breaker (2.00 / 0) #106 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 08:06:00 AM EST
Same piss, different shaped bottle.

So, can you now kill a man.  With your thumbs?


[ Parent ]

I don't know how you do things over there by MohammedNiyalSayeed (2.00 / 0) #111 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 10:18:33 AM EST

But over here, we use our index fingers as the trigger finger. The thumb is just too hard to pull a second time in a row.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

If you're trained to kill... by Breaker (2.00 / 0) #115 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 06:59:56 PM EST
Who needs a girly gun?


[ Parent ]

I don't have gender issues by MohammedNiyalSayeed (4.00 / 2) #118 Fri Jan 04, 2008 at 10:00:18 PM EST

I have "people being alive" issues. Think efficiency. Think three-round burst. Point and click. Drag and drop.


-
You can build the most elegant fountain in the world, but eventually a winged rat will be using it as a drinking bowl.
[ Parent ]

only idiots bring knives to gun fights. by garlic (2.00 / 0) #121 Sat Jan 05, 2008 at 02:15:27 AM EST

signatures are for assholes.
[ Parent ]

True... by Breaker (2.00 / 0) #124 Sat Jan 05, 2008 at 08:43:43 AM EST
But there's no wondering "did I shoot six or five bullets" with a knife.


[ Parent ]

or with modern guns. by garlic (2.00 / 0) #126 Sat Jan 05, 2008 at 12:34:28 PM EST

signatures are for assholes.
[ Parent ]

Whilst not a gunologist, by Breaker (2.00 / 0) #127 Sat Jan 05, 2008 at 02:47:41 PM EST
I'm pretty sure there's a finite number of bullets that can be either put into the gun, or carried.

A good knife however, doesn't even need sharpening to cause fatal injury.


[ Parent ]

It requires by blixco (2.00 / 0) #134 Sat Jan 05, 2008 at 05:03:55 PM EST
intimacy.

Try using a knife in a streetfight in Somalia.
---------------------------------
"You bring the weasel, I'll bring the whiskey." - kellnerin
[ Parent ]

But no reloading... by Breaker (2.00 / 0) #136 Sun Jan 06, 2008 at 12:39:53 PM EST
Try using a gun in a streetfight in Somalia.  With no bullets left.


[ Parent ]

If you didn't bring by blixco (2.00 / 0) #137 Sun Jan 06, 2008 at 02:02:34 PM EST
enough ammunition, you deserve whatever happens to you.  You'll never get within kissing distance to use a knife on someone, so you may as well stay at home.
---------------------------------
"You bring the weasel, I'll bring the whiskey." - kellnerin
[ Parent ]

Or... by Breaker (4.00 / 1) #140 Sun Jan 06, 2008 at 06:22:51 PM EST
Not go to a gun party.

The knife's just there if the kissing is wrong and the petting's getting too heavy.

Wise advice for USian foreign policy?

/troll.


[ Parent ]

We tried it once in the 30s and 40s by blixco (2.00 / 0) #141 Sun Jan 06, 2008 at 06:24:54 PM EST
but then Engerlund got all freaked out by the Germans and their constant bombing and we had to ride in and save the day, again, for democracy. 

</countertroll>
---------------------------------
"You bring the weasel, I'll bring the whiskey." - kellnerin
[ Parent ]

Not really. by Breaker (4.00 / 1) #142 Sun Jan 06, 2008 at 06:41:39 PM EST
You shortened the war.  A war you could have shortened by actually getting involved earlier.

But you (by which I mean USia) didn't, instead waiting for an economic opportunity.

Which USia did.

Do you know when UKia stopped paying war debt to USia?

OK google it then.

Maybe UKia couldn't have won WWII alone.  But it's a bit shit to run in on a game at 2-2 with 5 minutes to play, put your regional ringer player on and nick it at 3-2 in injury time and claim victory for region.

/bite


[ Parent ]

Heck yes. by blixco (4.00 / 3) #143 Sun Jan 06, 2008 at 08:26:22 PM EST
It's how we roll:

advantage, us.
---------------------------------
"You bring the weasel, I'll bring the whiskey." - kellnerin
[ Parent ]

a bit shit? by MillMan (2.00 / 0) #154 Mon Jan 14, 2008 at 04:26:29 AM EST
it's sound business practice.

When I'm imprisoned as an enemy combatant, will you blog about it?
[ Parent ]

Speaking of getting involved earlier . . . by Christopher Robin was Murdered (2.00 / 0) #155 Mon Jan 14, 2008 at 08:14:27 PM EST
I hear Czechoslovakia has some strong feelings about who should and should not have gotten involved earlier.

[ Parent ]

I'm sure by Breaker (2.00 / 0) #157 Tue Jan 15, 2008 at 03:41:09 AM EST
The people of Iraq are pleased at Western involvement in their country too.


[ Parent ]

On behalf of all countries involved from the getgo by Driusan (4.00 / 1)