Print Story Fuck You 60 Minutes
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By Big Sexxxy Joe (Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 04:48:33 PM EST) (all tags)
Sixty Minutes just ran a story about the Millennial or Generation Y, who were born between approximately 1980-1995.  Was it about how they have are just about the first American generation to have less than their parents?  Was it about all their fucking student loans?  Was it about their high voter turnout?  How about the fact that some of them have been killed or injured in a pointless war in a desperate attempt to get money for college?

Of course not, big media will only do one story about Generation Y and it is entirely subjective and unverifiable; that Generation Y is spoiled.  (Not that they were given as much as their parents or anything.)

The victim in this story is the innocent corporation that has selflessly taken on the burden of hiring these terrible monsters.

Since I’m spoiled and over-entitled I’ll use the Internet to answer some allegations.



Many of them live with their parents

Interestingly enough, it turns out that renting an apartment actually costs money.  Early generations made enough from manual labor jobs that they could buy houses in their twenties (and I consider them spoiled because of that :p).  Nowadays there aren’t many factory jobs in the U.S. and people are paid relatively less for many jobs.  So twenty-somethings have to find white-collar type jobs.  It turns out that these jobs pay little if you have little experience and progressively more as experience accumulates.  So Generation Yers have a little salaries and they have to pay their student loans back.

They aren’t loyal to their companies and leave if someone will pay them more

At first, this troubled me.  But then I found out that corporations actually lay off employees sometimes, even when they turn profits.  What’s more, they actually try to pay employees as little as possible, especially if their too young to be good at negotiating.  I remember when I heard “loyalty is dead” referring to businesses and their employees.  I believe I was five years old.

If someone will pay you more money than you make, you go work for him or her.  It’s not brain-surgery.  And when you are in your 20s it is not uncommon to be offered 20% than you are making.  I guess 60 Minutes has a problem with capitalism.

Generation Y expects crazy benefits at work and a work environment that carters to them in outrageous ways

Actually, this was initiated by information technology companies, such as Microsoft, before Generation Y joined the workforce.  The super-work environment thing has since expanded past Tech to companies such as Merrill-Lynch.  You can also retain employees and keep employees by paying them more, but these companies figured out the “super work environment” is cheaper and makes it easier to get overtime out of the workers.  Notice that only a relatively small number of employers do this and they are all expect the employees to work a lot of overtime.  My employer supplies bad generic coffee and strictly enforces the rule against using two packets at once.

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Fuck You 60 Minutes | 42 comments (42 topical, 0 hidden) | Trackback
Maybe I know why? by Linus Trollvalds (4.00 / 1) #1 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 05:03:29 PM EST
60 Minutes seem to be run by Baby Boomers getting ready to retire. People like George W. Bush are Baby Boomers.

Anyway they get old and say things like "Why when I was youngin I walked to school 35 miles in the snow, uphill both ways, dodging tornadoes and fighting off Communists who tried to kill me. I pulled myself up by my bootstraps and made billions without any help from the government or my parents. Kids today, they are spoiled rotten, get everything handed to them on a silver platter. In my day, slackers such as those in Generation Y, would be living out in the streets begging for food and be blacklisted by every known employer as being lazy and stupid. I do not understand why they like Emo things, what is Emo anyway? Why in my day we couldn't even show emotions, and if we did our parents would slap the taste out of our mouths for being whiny losers. Now a days, can't even spank a child without getting social services all over you for child abuse. Nah, kids today got it too easy, so we voted for George W. Bush, the meanest politician we could find, into office twice, because us Babyboomers outnumber the rest of the population and Bush is one of us. The Generation Y'ers will die in some foreign war that makes no sense for no reason, because they deserve it, you hear me, they deserve it for being spoiled rotten brats!"

I do have the sense to hate emo by Big Sexxxy Joe (2.00 / 0) #4 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 06:03:09 PM EST
Generation Y should be ashamed of emo.  On the other hand, some of the best metal is coming out these days.

I'm like Jesus, only better.
[ Parent ]
Ha by spacejack (4.00 / 2) #2 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 05:36:15 PM EST
I remember reading a similar hatchet job on Generation X, written by boomers, when I was in my teens. I remember the editorial was titled "don't trust anyone under 30." Something about my generation not being involved in enough hippy causes, or not writing enough flakey protest songs.

Also, I thought we were supposed to be the first generation to grow up to expect less than our parents. At least there was an actual recession to give that some credibility.

Gen X had less than their parents by Big Sexxxy Joe (2.00 / 0) #3 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 06:00:53 PM EST
So Gen Y is the second generation to have less than their parents.  So it's annoying to hear all this spoiled crap over and over.  There are spoiled people of every generation I suppose.  Some people are born into privilege and some people have to deal with a lot of crap.

I'm like Jesus, only better.
[ Parent ]
Yeah I agree by Linus Trollvalds (2.00 / 0) #8 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 06:29:23 PM EST
we younger people have less than our parents or grandparents have.

We have less of everything than they had.

Our parents had lots of stuff, 8 bit computers, BBSes, and 8 bit video game systems, 2 bedroom houses, big Buicks, a VCR (Betamax), 9 inch color TV set, Eight Track Tape players, pet rocks, and Rubik Cubes.

Our grandparents had lots of stuff vacuum tube radios, record players, black and white 9 inch TV sets, 2 bedroom houses, hula hoops, and baseball bats and gloves.

Today we Generation Y'ers have a lot less. iPods, iPhones, 64 bit computers that can do just about anything we want them to, XBox 360 or Wii or Playstation 3 video game consoles, wireless Internet, free online porn, BitTorrent for lots of free stuff, 32 inch HDTV digital television sets with TIVO boxes, CD/DVD/MP3 Music Stereo systems with 8 speakers, Transformer and Star Wars toys, cell phones, tax breaks, federal backed programs like emergency family leave and short-term and long-term disability programs, 4 bedroom houses, hybrid cars that get 40 miles per gallon or more, microwaves, online forums where we can post diaries about how worse off we are than our parents and grandparents, plus a higher minimum wage and more college education and our student loans give us tax breaks.

Yeah we have a lot less than our parents or grandparents.

[ Parent ]
blah by Big Sexxxy Joe (2.00 / 0) #10 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 06:48:28 PM EST
There's more technology but real wages are down.

So a Gen X or Gen Y should expect a smaller house than his parents.  And college is obviously more and more expensive and more necessary.  As for better fuel efficiency, the standards have been stagnant and fuel is pretty fucking expensive lately.  Not that I have a car or anything...

And minimum wage is lower when adjusted for inflation.  The 1960's minimum wage would be like $12 an hour.  I hope you're trolling because it would pretty unfortunate if you didn't know that.

I'm like Jesus, only better.

[ Parent ]
I hope you know by Linus Trollvalds (2.00 / 0) #16 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 03:56:28 AM EST
that I not have much. I don't get out much, mostly I write programs but hardly get paid. I write open source software and kernel hacking, but nobody want pay me. I keep too busy to see things.

I not know that minimum wage was $12 an hour in the 1960's, they must have lowered it when Bush went into office or something?

I not know much, but I do know what I talk about.

[ Parent ]
Gen X has fewer offspring and less home ownership. by chuckles (4.00 / 2) #11 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 07:39:51 PM EST
Everything else is shiny baubles.

"The one absolutely certain way of bringing this nation to ruin [...] would be to permit it to become a tangle of squabbling nationalities"
[ Parent ]
Then why do by Linus Trollvalds (2.00 / 0) #17 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 03:57:13 AM EST
the illegal immigrant work for under minimum wage and have more than gen Y or gen X people?

[ Parent ]
generation Y certainly is spoiled... by gzt (4.00 / 1) #5 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 06:07:05 PM EST
...but those points aren't at all what it's about. I mean, like, #1, whatevs, that's not per se evidence of spoiling, that was the norm for thousands of years. #2, well, that's the culture the corporations are promoting, not what the workers are necessarily seeking. #3, again, that's what the marketplace is supporting, and, even then, not so much, given how shitty (viz) most employers' health coverage is.

Okay by Big Sexxxy Joe (2.00 / 0) #7 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 06:15:10 PM EST
So in what sense is it spoiled then?

I'm like Jesus, only better.
[ Parent ]
they're moderns. by gzt (2.00 / 0) #9 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 06:32:13 PM EST
and they're Americans.

[ Parent ]
No one from Gen X on is willing to work ... by lm (4.00 / 1) #19 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 04:10:36 AM EST
Okay, there are some folks that are. But understand, by working, I don't mean white collar work. I mean manual labor. Ever generation from Gen X on has been conditioned that there is something shameful about physical labor. I suspect that this is one of the chief reasons (but certainly not the only one) behind the decline in labor power in the US.

There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]
I don't know about that by Bob Abooey (2.00 / 0) #20 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 04:25:53 AM EST
I think they think there's something bad about doing physical labour for less than $75 per hour with two paid 20 minute smoke breaks and one paid hour for lunch and 4 paid 10 minute breaks for snacks and 6 weeks paid vacation and 14 paid sick days and 7 paid personal days and guaranteed 15% pay raises each year. After all, that's what made American great in the 40's and 50's, no?

Warmest regards,
--Your best pal Bob

How's my blogging: Call me at 209.867.5309 to complain.

[ Parent ]
I certainly agree part of the problem is wages by lm (2.00 / 0) #21 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 04:38:46 AM EST
I've been saying for a long time that part of the problem is that USians aren't willing to clean toilets for a substandard wage. Mandate a living wage and some of the stigma of manual labor will be removed.

But I'm not so certain that wages dropped first. Somewhere along the lines, not going to college became a mark of shame.


There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]
To a degree, yes by Bob Abooey (4.00 / 1) #22 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 04:50:19 AM EST
I think we collectively got fat. I've got a friend who came over to USia from Croatia with nothing but the shirt on his back. He worked shit jobs 7 days a week for years and saved and invested and sacrificed and bought his own business and worked 7 days a week and saved and etc etc and today he's got a pretty good life. Meanwhile what percentage of USian born people are willing to do that? I'd guess it's a pretty low percentage.

We, painting with a broad brush, seem to have a sense of entitlement. We want a great job without having to work our way up the ladder. We think things like music and movies should be FREE. That's not what made this country great and why we, much like Rome and Microsoft did before us, will wither and die.

Warmest regards,
--Your best pal Bob

How's my blogging: Call me at 209.867.5309 to complain.

[ Parent ]
I agree with your observations of your friend by lm (2.00 / 0) #34 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 08:42:39 AM EST
But to be fair, I bet the percentage of Croatians willing to do what your friend did is also fairly low. Otherwise, Croatia would be the major economic powerhouse of Europe.

There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]
Yeah by Bob Abooey (2.00 / 0) #35 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 09:08:39 AM EST
Or it could be that they don't have the opportunities available to them that even the most common of commoners have in the USA.

But yeah - my friend is a bit of a nutter - he probably has some deep seeded issues that have driven him to devote his life to working and improving his station in life. God knows I don't have those attributes, be they good or bad.

Warmest regards,
--Your best pal Bob

How's my blogging: Call me at 209.867.5309 to complain.

[ Parent ]
Croatia by ucblockhead (2.00 / 0) #41 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 05:20:35 PM EST
...apparently has a pretty strong middle class. At least so says the Croatian project manager I used to work with.
---
[ucblockhead is] useless and subhuman
[ Parent ]
This is true by Big Sexxxy Joe (2.00 / 0) #38 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 05:08:45 PM EST
It is driven by economics.  While it is true that manual labor is hard, it is the fact that it is no longer well paid that makes it unattractive.

Back in the day that Keynesian economics ruled, a large middle class was artificially created and it wasn't so hard to be part of it.  But we turned our back on that great system and our economy has suffered.

I'm like Jesus, only better.

[ Parent ]
I strongly disagree by georgeha (4.00 / 1) #23 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 05:05:17 AM EST
I remember in the 1970's (when Gen X would have been in elementary school) the steel mills were shrinking in Buffalo because the Japanese mills were newer and made steel cheaper. Bethlehem's management didn't update it's equipment enough to compete.

Labor costs were higher, too, you can blame management and the unions for not recognizing and dealing with the threat of foreign steel.

The same thing goes for the auto industry.


[ Parent ]
Right you are Ha! by Bob Abooey (2.00 / 0) #28 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 06:23:22 AM EST
In many respects the unions and management in general want to think it's still 1950.

Warmest regards,
--Your best pal Bob

How's my blogging: Call me at 209.867.5309 to complain.

[ Parent ]
I don't understand where the disagreement is by lm (2.00 / 0) #31 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 08:18:06 AM EST
Are you arguing that the decline of labor power is entirely a function of white collar mismanagement of the industrial sector in the seventies? If not, I can't figure out what I wrote that contradicts what you say.

There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]
Blaming elementary school kids for the decline by georgeha (2.00 / 0) #32 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 08:20:03 AM EST
in labor power. Change that generation X reference to the Greatest Generation, or the Silent Generation, or Baby Boomers and my disagreement goes away.


[ Parent ]
I don't believe I blamed elementary school kids by lm (2.00 / 0) #33 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 08:39:04 AM EST
You have to interpret ``one of the chief reasons (but certainly not the only one)'' as ``the primary reason'' or as ``the only reason'' to get to a point where your very valid point contradicts what I said.

Out of curiosity, do you hold that labor power declined more in the seventies than it has in the eighties and nineties? I'll concede that labor unions declined slightly more with regards to what percentage of the work force belongs to a union. But I don't think that decline in actual union power with regards to significant political and negotiating clout didn't start to decline until the late eighties and early nineties.

But I will agree with this. The greatest generation and the baby boomers are the ones that raised Gen X and those that came after to by and large disdain manual labor. The attitude I see so much of that some jobs are `beneath' a person didn't mysteriously appear from the aether. It's a social and cultural construct.


There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]
I do think labor power declined more in the 80's by georgeha (2.00 / 0) #36 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 09:43:54 AM EST
and 90's, collective bargaining doesn't work when there is a significant workforce not involved in the collective part. In the 70's, labor had lots of power, but it was power on a sinking ship. I can't think of too many instances were labor and management worked together for the betterment of the country.

I'm still not sure about that attitude. There are a lot fewer blue collar labor intensive jobs now, if someone with a high school education could get a living wage at the local Ford plant just by walking in, I think more people would pursue it.


[ Parent ]
With this shortage in manual laborers... by chuckles (2.00 / 0) #26 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 05:58:06 AM EST

... the wages employers must pay for manual labor must be sky-high, amiright?

Or maybe you should look for another reason why Gen Xers shy away from manual labor.



"The one absolutely certain way of bringing this nation to ruin [...] would be to permit it to become a tangle of squabbling nationalities"
[ Parent ]
Sky high? by lm (2.00 / 0) #30 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 08:17:54 AM EST
I don't think so. Most studies that I am aware of that have looked at increases in the minimum wage have not demonstrated a rise in consumer prices past the increase in wages. While I'll concede that there may very well be a point at which such an eventuality occurs, I'll leave it up to you to point me me towards a creditable source that says such is likely.

There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]
Perhaps I did not make my sarcasm obvious enough by chuckles (2.00 / 0) #37 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 10:58:47 AM EST
You are arguing that Gen Xers are, in general, not willing to perform manual labor, correct? Ceteris paribus, that would lead to a manual labor shortage and an increase in the real wages of manual laborers. That increase in wages isn't happening, so what else do you think is going on?

"The one absolutely certain way of bringing this nation to ruin [...] would be to permit it to become a tangle of squabbling nationalities"
[ Parent ]
we're importing manual laborers by aphrael (2.00 / 0) #42 Tue Nov 13, 2007 at 10:07:34 AM EST
You Gen Y fuckers make pretty good pr0n; by Horatio Hellpop (4.00 / 1) #6 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 06:14:28 PM EST
it's all you're good for.

Also, I don't know who taught you how to slack, but the proper response to that last bit is to tear open the third packet, dump it in the filter basket and tell The Man to Fuck. The. Fuck. Off.

"You can't really know something until you ruin it for everyone." -some guy who used to have an account here

Gen Y spoiled? Wait and see the next one... by bob6 (4.00 / 1) #12 Sun Nov 11, 2007 at 10:14:52 PM EST
Bah, looks like the same old drivel. Baby-boomers ain't the first generation to ramble on how kids are spoiled...

bob6, who is Gen X'

Cheers.
You know... by theboz (4.00 / 1) #13 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 12:24:58 AM EST
I too remember seeing this about Generation X.  They probably took the same story and just reshot it with a few different words.

The Baby Boomers are the biggest bunch of spoiled pricks on the planet.  They didn't earn their keep -- they just were lucky enough to be the kids of the WW2 era people who made tons of sacrifices for their families.  We on the other hand, got mostly bupkiss from our boomer parents.

By the way, I was born I guess at the tail end of Generation X based on your numbers, so I'm not defending myself here.  Just calling things how I see them.
- - - - -
That's what I always say about you, boz, you have a good memory for random facts about pussy. -- joh3n

Me too by Big Sexxxy Joe (2.00 / 0) #14 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 02:03:19 AM EST
But I've heard different numbers, so I could be X or Y.

I'm like Jesus, only better.
[ Parent ]
Others have eluded to this by Big Sexxxy Joe (2.00 / 0) #15 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 02:12:15 AM EST
But now that I think about it, the baby boomers really just trash talk all other generations.  This includes their own parents (WWII), people younger than them (Gen X), and their own children (Gen Y). 

Generation X seems to have got it the worst, because they are neither their own parents or children.  (Their rock stars belong to the generation between them and their parents.)

I'm like Jesus, only better.

Two points by lm (2.00 / 0) #18 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 04:02:00 AM EST
First, there is no Generation Y. It's a meaningless term that tends to mean whatever the person using it wants it to. Talk to ten demographers and, unlike Gen X or The Baby Boom, you'll get ten different definitions of Gen Y.

Second, 60 minutes jumped the shark a decade or two ago. I blame Geraldo Rivera.


There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
Pfui. by ObviousTroll (2.00 / 0) #24 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 05:06:37 AM EST
Was it about how they have are just about the first American generation to have less than their parents?  Was it about all their fucking student loans?  Was it about their high voter turnout?  How about the fact that some of them have been killed or injured in a pointless war in a desperate attempt to get money for college?

Feh. Please revisit your history of Gen-X before you claim Gen-Y was the first at any of these things. They're all (mostly) in debt, they were the first generation to decide it was easier to live with Mommy and Daddy instead of moving out, et cetera and ad nauseum.

Actually, the entire concept of a "generation" is a media creation to make it easier to pigeon hole you. I'm sorry to hear you bought into it.

--
Has anybody seen my clue? I know I had it when I came in here.

Feh Umpth by Big Sexxxy Joe (2.00 / 0) #40 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 05:16:37 PM EST
I said one the first to have less than their parents, because they are the second.  Gen Y has bigger student loans.  Gen X has always had a poor voter turnout.  And they had no war that significantly challenged the U.S.

And I wouldn't say my friend chose to live with their parents...

There is some truth out of the concept of a generation, and in some ways it is a self-fulfilling that becomes real because people believe it.

I'm like Jesus, only better.

[ Parent ]
Ahem by ni (4.00 / 4) #25 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 05:36:50 AM EST
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqfFrCUrEbY

But honestly, you've let yourself get trolled by 60 Minutes. It's a stupid claim to make. It's painting with a fantastically broad brush. It is not (or I cannot imagine 60 Minutes being) rigorous or thorough enough to say anything meaningful about the trends that do exist, and even if it could, the explanations for these are fantastically, monstrously complicated.

Why care? This has all the intellectual authenticity of a name calling playground squabble.


"What woman wouldn't love a guy in WW2 aviator glasses eating their ass?" -- dest

4'ed by spacejack (2.00 / 0) #27 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 06:17:11 AM EST
for the awesome video.

[ Parent ]
Hahahaha by ucblockhead (4.00 / 1) #29 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 06:52:21 AM EST
I gather they just ran a report from twenty years ago and did a search and replace, changing 'X' to 'Y'.
---
[ucblockhead is] useless and subhuman
Probably by Big Sexxxy Joe (2.00 / 0) #39 Mon Nov 12, 2007 at 05:12:24 PM EST
The media is nothing if not lazy.

I'm like Jesus, only better.
[ Parent ]
Fuck You 60 Minutes | 42 comments (42 topical, 0 hidden) | Trackback