Best Pope?

Peter   1 vote - 33 %
Leo I   1 vote - 33 %
Gregory I   0 votes - 0 %
Leo IV   0 votes - 0 %
Sergius III   0 votes - 0 %
Nicholas I   0 votes - 0 %
Nicholas II   0 votes - 0 %
Gregory VII   0 votes - 0 %
Innocent III   0 votes - 0 %
Alexander VI   0 votes - 0 %
Julius II   0 votes - 0 %
Paul III   0 votes - 0 %
Innocent X   0 votes - 0 %
Pius IX   1 vote - 33 %
Leo XIII   0 votes - 0 %
John Paul II   0 votes - 0 %
Benedict XVI   0 votes - 0 %
WIPO   0 votes - 0 %
 
3 Total Votes
Dunno about the Pope and dope by lm (4.00 / 1) #1 Sat Jan 16, 2010 at 02:24:05 PM EST
So far as I am aware, the only Vatican endorsed recreational drug was cocaine.

I'm not a huge Pius XII fan (in fact I don't think he was a very good pope) but I can't help but wonder if a good deal of the criticism of him isn't overblown.  Any way you slice it, he was in an extraordinarily difficult position with a full array of bad options to decide between. While I think a good argument can be made that he didn't choose the best of the bad options, much of the information that suggests he took the worse of the bad options is only available in hindsight.


There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
And alcohol. by ambrosen (4.00 / 1) #2 Sat Jan 16, 2010 at 02:44:51 PM EST
That's quite well used in Catholic countries, I believe.

[ Parent ]
Well, doh! by Tonatiuh (4.00 / 1) #12 Sun Jan 17, 2010 at 03:23:54 PM EST
Jesus converted water in wine, and when the time came for his departure he commemorated the occasion with a symbolic conversion of wine on his own blood.

Some people, specially from some  very peculiar fundamentalist Christian sects, haven't read the Bible, or simply ignore some bits that I can't simply understand how  can be possibly ignored.

[ Parent ]
Yeah, there is that by lm (2.00 / 0) #20 Mon Jan 18, 2010 at 08:45:07 PM EST
But I have a hard time considering alcohol (or even cannabis) to be in the same class as cocaine. There are drugs and then there are drugs.

There is no more degenerate kind of state than that in which the richest are supposed to be the best.
Cicero, The Republic
[ Parent ]
(Comment Deleted) by xth (4.00 / 2) #5 Sat Jan 16, 2010 at 04:02:07 PM EST

This comment has been deleted by xth



[ Parent ]
Thanks for the Avatar Metacontextual link. by muchagecko (4.00 / 1) #3 Sat Jan 16, 2010 at 02:50:48 PM EST
Something I'll share with the folks who didn't get Avatar.


A purpose gives you a reason to wake up every morning.
So a purpose is like a box of powdered donut holes?
Exactly
My Name is Earl

Indeed, that was funny by priestess (2.00 / 0) #21 Wed Jan 20, 2010 at 06:18:25 AM EST
Beautiful movie though.

Pre............
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Chat to the virtual me...

[ Parent ]
I could have done better with a more diverse by muchagecko (2.00 / 0) #22 Wed Jan 20, 2010 at 01:46:26 PM EST
color palette.

And watching Avatar next to a world artist probably added to my unimpressed attitude.


A purpose gives you a reason to wake up every morning.
So a purpose is like a box of powdered donut holes?
Exactly
My Name is Earl

[ Parent ]
Pope and Galileo by ucblockhead (4.00 / 1) #4 Sat Jan 16, 2010 at 03:31:47 PM EST
I suspect the paucity of info on the Galileo thing was because from the church's perspective, it was a minor little issue hardly worthy of note.
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[ucblockhead is] useless and subhuman
(Comment Deleted) by xth (4.00 / 1) #6 Sat Jan 16, 2010 at 04:39:22 PM EST

This comment has been deleted by xth



BNP Bombs by Herring (4.00 / 2) #7 Sat Jan 16, 2010 at 05:54:56 PM EST
Considering that there are only 15,000 members of the BNP, having 3 convicted of serious offences like this seems like it merits a bit more media attention. It's almost as if some of the British press secretly agree with them. Or not so secretly.

On a lighter note, Bad Science.

You can't inspire people with facts
- Small Gods

And as it turns out, Pius was right. by ammoniacal (4.00 / 1) #8 Sun Jan 17, 2010 at 04:16:20 AM EST
Communism killed far more people than the Fascists could ever hope to kill.

"To this day that was the most bullshit caesar salad I have every experienced..." - triggerfinger

Only 'coz the commies won WW2 by clover kicker (4.00 / 1) #10 Sun Jan 17, 2010 at 08:17:57 AM EST
Would Russia have been a kinder, gentler place under Hitler's boot then Stalin's?


[ Parent ]
Depends. by ammoniacal (4.00 / 1) #11 Sun Jan 17, 2010 at 03:03:33 PM EST
How hard and long would the average Russian resisted the Nazi occupational government? Years?

"To this day that was the most bullshit caesar salad I have every experienced..." - triggerfinger

[ Parent ]
hard to say, ain't it? by clover kicker (4.00 / 2) #17 Mon Jan 18, 2010 at 12:02:09 PM EST
How many people would the Nazis have killed or starved to make more lebensraum?

All I know is that everything I read about Russia and Ukraine in the 20th century makes me profoundly glad to have been born in Canada.

[ Parent ]
Not in the context of the war. by Tonatiuh (4.00 / 1) #13 Sun Jan 17, 2010 at 03:26:56 PM EST
When was when an enlightened Pope would have been needed.

[ Parent ]
I'm not convinced of that by TheophileEscargot (4.00 / 2) #14 Sun Jan 17, 2010 at 05:09:00 PM EST
The arguments that I've seen tend to rely on there being more deaths in the Stalin-era famines than in the Holocaust.

But I'm not convinced you can lump in famine deaths with deliberate murders. And the people doing that generally exclude the indirect death toll of World War 2. Some of them even find some reason to exclude the Indian famine deaths of the Raj era, which otherwise could make Capitalism score worse than either Nazism or Communism.

Also, these famines didn't get going till 15 years into Communism, and Nazism didn't last that long. If Hitler had successfully invaded the Ukraine, I'm not sure his farms there would have been any better than Stalin's.
--
It is unlikely that the good of a snail should reside in its shell: so is it likely that the good of a man should?

[ Parent ]
Nazi policy in the Ukraine by jump the ladder (4.00 / 1) #16 Mon Jan 18, 2010 at 07:19:20 AM EST
Was to deliberately starve the towns so the agricultural surplus could be used to feed Germany. For pragmatic military reasons they gave up this policy as they lacked the troops to enforce it and they lacked a secure hold in the area.

[ Parent ]
Pornocracy by Scrymarch (4.00 / 1) #9 Sun Jan 17, 2010 at 05:47:57 AM EST
Is a word that is used far too infrequently.

Iambic Web Certified

The Devil Wears Prada by duxup (4.00 / 1) #15 Sun Jan 17, 2010 at 09:56:33 PM EST
That Hathaway girl is hot, otherwise the film didn't even seem to make sense once she got to Paris.  The have your cake and eat it too ending seemed way too easy.

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The thing is by TheophileEscargot (4.00 / 1) #18 Mon Jan 18, 2010 at 03:17:01 PM EST
Working for American Vogue seems to be the very top of the fashion-writing industry. It's the equivalent of what working at Google is in the computer industry.

So while fashion by some accounts can be an exploitative, shallow, ugly, ruthless business; it's not really the place to show it. If you wanted to make a movie about how terrible it can be to work with computers, you probably wouldn't set it at the top a fictionalized Google.
--
It is unlikely that the good of a snail should reside in its shell: so is it likely that the good of a man should?

[ Parent ]
Yar by duxup (4.00 / 1) #19 Mon Jan 18, 2010 at 03:40:58 PM EST

Something else bothered me too. There is a scene where Streep berates Hathaway (did I mention she's hot?) about her attitude that all this high fashion garbage doesn't matter to her. Streep explains that all this fashion influences other fashion and you end up wearing it even if you shop in some cheap store or something.... I was left thinking so? That character is an ass, that industry self absorbed and asstastic, and the fact that some bit of it ends up on a wallmart shelf somewhere … makes it ok or something?
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[ Parent ]